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Posted May 16 2002 21:00

Re: RHIZOME_RARE Webby awards...

how true this is, marc

—– Original Message —–
From: <info@furtherfield.org>
To: <Rare_Chat@rhizome.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 5:35 PM
Subject: RHIZOME_RARE Webby awards…


>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> boundary="—-=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50"
>
>
> ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="Windows-1252"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> BlankBecause furtherfield has a small budget with and all of it it goes =
> towards getting various projects underway, we cannot afford to enter the =
> Webby Awards. We are continuously getting projects started and into =
> fruition and have no issue in fund ourselves and projects, sites, =
> experimentations, out of our own wage packets. I was thinking how many =
> other groups who are bothering to create social Internet projects are =
> being left out because of such a situation?
>
>
> marc garrett
>
> http://www.furtherfield.org
> http://www.futhernoise.org
> http://www.dido.uk.net/
>
>
>
> ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="Windows-1252"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> <HTML><HEAD><TITLE id=ridTitle>Blank</TITLE>
> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; =
> charset=windows-1252"><BASE
> href="file://C:Program FilesCommon FilesMicrosoft =
> SharedStationery">
> <STYLE>BODY {
> MARGIN-TOP: 25px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 25px; COLOR: #000000; =
> FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica
> }
> P.msoNormal {
> MARGIN-TOP: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; COLOR: #ffffcc; =
> FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, "Times New Roman"
> }
> LI.msoNormal {
> MARGIN-TOP: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; COLOR: #ffffcc; =
> FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, "Times New Roman"
> }
> </STYLE>
>
> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2715.400" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
> <BODY id=ridBody bgColor=#ffffff
> background=cid:003801c1f6a6$054a8b60$7828fdd5@FURTHERFIELD>
> <DIV>Because furtherfield has&nbsp;a small&nbsp;budget with and all of =
> it it
> goes towards getting various projects underway, we cannot afford to =
> enter the
> Webby Awards. We are continuously getting projects started and into =
> fruition and
> have no issue in fund ourselves and projects, sites, =
> experimentations,&nbsp;out
> of our own wage packets. I was thinking how many other groups who are =
> bothering
> to create social Internet projects are being left out because of such a
> situation? </DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>marc garrett</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><A =
> href="http://www.furtherfield.org">http://www.furtherfield.org</A></DIV=
> >
> <DIV><A =
> href="http://www.futhernoise.org">http://www.futhernoise.org</A></DIV>
> <DIV><U><FONT color=#0000ff><A
> href="http://www.dido.uk.net/">http://www.dido.uk.net/</A></FONT></U><A=
>
> href="http://www.dido"></A></DIV>
> <P>&nbsp;</P></BODY></HTML>
>
> ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50–
>
> ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> Content-Type: image/gif;
> name="Blank Bkgrd.gif"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
> Content-ID: <003801c1f6a6$054a8b60$7828fdd5@FURTHERFIELD>
>
>
R0lGODlhLQAtAID/AP////f39ywAAAAALQAtAEACcAxup8vtvxKQsFon6d02898pGkgiYoCm6sq2
>
7iqWcmzOsmeXeA7uPJd5CYdD2g9oPF58ygqz+XhCG9JpJGmlYrPXGlfr/Yo/VW45e7amp2tou/lW
> xo/zX513z+Vt+1n/tiX2pxP4NUhy2FM4xtjIUQAAOw==
>
> ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50–
>
>
> + …a shake / to ask if there is some mistake
> -> Rhizome.org
> -> post: list@rhizome.org
> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php3
>
>

marc garrett May 17 2002 01:00Reply

The only way out of this default like tactic created by such awards that in
their function perpetrate the problem, is to form our own underground art
awards, for those who are not accepted merely because of not having the
money to pay such subscriptions. Yet I can't help thinking that we have
enough to do anyway…isn't it up to them, to move on and develop a way
forward?

marc


> how true this is, marc
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: <info@furtherfield.org>
> To: <Rare_Chat@rhizome.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 5:35 PM
> Subject: RHIZOME_RARE Webby awards…
>
>
> >
> > This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> >
> > ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> > boundary="—-=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50"
> >
> >
> > ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> > charset="Windows-1252"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > BlankBecause furtherfield has a small budget with and all of it it goes
=
> > towards getting various projects underway, we cannot afford to enter the
=
> > Webby Awards. We are continuously getting projects started and into =
> > fruition and have no issue in fund ourselves and projects, sites, =
> > experimentations, out of our own wage packets. I was thinking how many =
> > other groups who are bothering to create social Internet projects are =
> > being left out because of such a situation?
> >
> >
> > marc garrett
> >
> > http://www.furtherfield.org
> > http://www.futhernoise.org
> > http://www.dido.uk.net/
> >
> >
> >
> > ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > Content-Type: text/html;
> > charset="Windows-1252"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> > <HTML><HEAD><TITLE id=ridTitle>Blank</TITLE>
> > <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; =
> > charset=windows-1252"><BASE
> > href="file://C:Program FilesCommon FilesMicrosoft =
> > SharedStationery">
> > <STYLE>BODY {
> > MARGIN-TOP: 25px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 25px; COLOR: #000000; =
> > FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica
> > }
> > P.msoNormal {
> > MARGIN-TOP: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; COLOR: #ffffcc; =
> > FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, "Times New Roman"
> > }
> > LI.msoNormal {
> > MARGIN-TOP: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; COLOR: #ffffcc; =
> > FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, "Times New Roman"
> > }
> > </STYLE>
> >
> > <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2715.400" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
> > <BODY id=ridBody bgColor=#ffffff
> > background=cid:003801c1f6a6$054a8b60$7828fdd5@FURTHERFIELD>
> > <DIV>Because furtherfield has&nbsp;a small&nbsp;budget with and all of =
> > it it
> > goes towards getting various projects underway, we cannot afford to =
> > enter the
> > Webby Awards. We are continuously getting projects started and into =
> > fruition and
> > have no issue in fund ourselves and projects, sites, =
> > experimentations,&nbsp;out
> > of our own wage packets. I was thinking how many other groups who are =
> > bothering
> > to create social Internet projects are being left out because of such
a
> > situation? </DIV>
> > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > <DIV>marc garrett</DIV>
> > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > <DIV><A =
> >
href="http://www.furtherfield.org">http://www.furtherfield.org</A></DIV=
> > >
> > <DIV><A =
> > href="http://www.futhernoise.org">http://www.futhernoise.org</A></DIV>
> > <DIV><U><FONT color=#0000ff><A
> >
href="http://www.dido.uk.net/">http://www.dido.uk.net/</A></FONT></U><A=
> >
> > href="http://www.dido"></A></DIV>
> > <P>&nbsp;</P></BODY></HTML>
> >
> > ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50–
> >
> > ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > Content-Type: image/gif;
> > name="Blank Bkgrd.gif"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
> > Content-ID: <003801c1f6a6$054a8b60$7828fdd5@FURTHERFIELD>
> >
> >
>
R0lGODlhLQAtAID/AP////f39ywAAAAALQAtAEACcAxup8vtvxKQsFon6d02898pGkgiYoCm6sq2
> >
>
7iqWcmzOsmeXeA7uPJd5CYdD2g9oPF58ygqz+XhCG9JpJGmlYrPXGlfr/Yo/VW45e7amp2tou/lW
> > xo/zX513z+Vt+1n/tiX2pxP4NUhy2FM4xtjIUQAAOw==
> >
> > ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50–
> >
> >
> > + …a shake / to ask if there is some mistake
> > -> Rhizome.org
> > -> post: list@rhizome.org
> > -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> > -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/subscribe.rhiz
> > -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> > +
> > Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> > Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php3
> >
> >
>
>
> + Hot turks on Cy Young patrol
> -> Rhizome.org
> -> post: list@rhizome.org
> -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/subscribe.rhiz
> -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> +
> Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php3
>

alexandra reill May 17 2002 01:00Reply

there is lots of such things going on, and i think we all can take the
chance and submit / participate / contribute / show our pieces.

i don't really think it is about underground or not as during time each
single underground thing becoming successful will eventually find itself in
the rows of the 'known and mighty' ones. i see it much simpler - good things
prove themselves anyways.

but i totally agree on digital art projects being very expensive to produce
and new ways of perception need to be focused on for better chances for the
development of digital art projects. more sponsoring and a better
communication / cooperation between enterprises and artists might be a way.

see you, a
—————————————————————
kanonmedia.com
non - profit org for new media

amadeus house
99_48, mariahilfer st.
a-1060 vienna
call: ++43 - 1 - 920 70 03
mailto: office@kanonmedia.com
visit: www.kanonmedia.com
—————————————————————
—– Original Message —–
From: "furtherfield" <info@furtherfield.org>
To: "kanonmedia.com" <office@kanonmedia.com>; <list@rhizome.org>
Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 5:55 PM
Subject: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: RHIZOME_RARE Webby awards…


> The only way out of this default like tactic created by such awards that
in
> their function perpetrate the problem, is to form our own underground art
> awards, for those who are not accepted merely because of not having the
> money to pay such subscriptions. Yet I can't help thinking that we have
> enough to do anyway…isn't it up to them, to move on and develop a way
> forward?
>
> marc
>
>
> > how true this is, marc
> >
> > —– Original Message —–
> > From: <info@furtherfield.org>
> > To: <Rare_Chat@rhizome.org>
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 5:35 PM
> > Subject: RHIZOME_RARE Webby awards…
> >
> >
> > >
> > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> > >
> > > ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > > Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> > > boundary="—-=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50"
> > >
> > >
> > > ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > > Content-Type: text/plain;
> > > charset="Windows-1252"
> > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> > >
> > > BlankBecause furtherfield has a small budget with and all of it it
goes
> =
> > > towards getting various projects underway, we cannot afford to enter
the
> =
> > > Webby Awards. We are continuously getting projects started and into =
> > > fruition and have no issue in fund ourselves and projects, sites, =
> > > experimentations, out of our own wage packets. I was thinking how many
=
> > > other groups who are bothering to create social Internet projects are
=
> > > being left out because of such a situation?
> > >
> > >
> > > marc garrett
> > >
> > > http://www.furtherfield.org
> > > http://www.futhernoise.org
> > > http://www.dido.uk.net/
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > > Content-Type: text/html;
> > > charset="Windows-1252"
> > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> > >
> > > <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> > > <HTML><HEAD><TITLE id=ridTitle>Blank</TITLE>
> > > <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; =
> > > charset=windows-1252"><BASE
> > > href="file://C:Program FilesCommon FilesMicrosoft =
> > > SharedStationery">
> > > <STYLE>BODY {
> > > MARGIN-TOP: 25px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 25px; COLOR: #000000;
=
> > > FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica
> > > }
> > > P.msoNormal {
> > > MARGIN-TOP: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; COLOR: #ffffcc; =
> > > FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, "Times New Roman"
> > > }
> > > LI.msoNormal {
> > > MARGIN-TOP: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; COLOR: #ffffcc; =
> > > FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, "Times New Roman"
> > > }
> > > </STYLE>
> > >
> > > <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2715.400" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
> > > <BODY id=ridBody bgColor=#ffffff
> > > background=cid:003801c1f6a6$054a8b60$7828fdd5@FURTHERFIELD>
> > > <DIV>Because furtherfield has&nbsp;a small&nbsp;budget with and all of
=
> > > it it
> > > goes towards getting various projects underway, we cannot afford to =
> > > enter the
> > > Webby Awards. We are continuously getting projects started and into =
> > > fruition and
> > > have no issue in fund ourselves and projects, sites, =
> > > experimentations,&nbsp;out
> > > of our own wage packets. I was thinking how many other groups who are
=
> > > bothering
> > > to create social Internet projects are being left out because of such
> a
> > > situation? </DIV>
> > > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > > <DIV>marc garrett</DIV>
> > > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > > <DIV><A =
> > >
> href="http://www.furtherfield.org">http://www.furtherfield.org</A></DIV=
> > > >
> > > <DIV><A =
> > >
href="http://www.futhernoise.org">http://www.futhernoise.org</A></DIV>
> > > <DIV><U><FONT color=#0000ff><A
> > >
> href="http://www.dido.uk.net/">http://www.dido.uk.net/</A></FONT></U><A=
> > >
> > > href="http://www.dido"></A></DIV>
> > > <P>&nbsp;</P></BODY></HTML>
> > >
> > > ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50–
> > >
> > > ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > > Content-Type: image/gif;
> > > name="Blank Bkgrd.gif"
> > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
> > > Content-ID: <003801c1f6a6$054a8b60$7828fdd5@FURTHERFIELD>
> > >
> > >
> >
>
R0lGODlhLQAtAID/AP////f39ywAAAAALQAtAEACcAxup8vtvxKQsFon6d02898pGkgiYoCm6sq2
> > >
> >
>
7iqWcmzOsmeXeA7uPJd5CYdD2g9oPF58ygqz+XhCG9JpJGmlYrPXGlfr/Yo/VW45e7amp2tou/lW
> > > xo/zX513z+Vt+1n/tiX2pxP4NUhy2FM4xtjIUQAAOw==
> > >
> > > ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50–
> > >
> > >
> > > + …a shake / to ask if there is some mistake
> > > -> Rhizome.org
> > > -> post: list@rhizome.org
> > > -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> > > -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/subscribe.rhiz
> > > -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> > > +
> > > Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> > > Membership Agreement available online at
http://rhizome.org/info/29.php3
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > + Hot turks on Cy Young patrol
> > -> Rhizome.org
> > -> post: list@rhizome.org
> > -> questions: info@rhizome.org
> > -> subscribe/unsubscribe: http://rhizome.org/subscribe.rhiz
> > -> give: http://rhizome.org/support
> > +
> > Subscribers to Rhizome are subject to the terms set out in the
> > Membership Agreement available online at http://rhizome.org/info/29.php3
> >
>
>
>
>
>

marc garrett May 17 2002 01:00Reply

clearly put and i agree

marc


> there is lots of such things going on, and i think we all can take the
> chance and submit / participate / contribute / show our pieces.
>
> i don't really think it is about underground or not as during time each
> single underground thing becoming successful will eventually find itself
in
> the rows of the 'known and mighty' ones. i see it much simpler - good
things
> prove themselves anyways.
>
> but i totally agree on digital art projects being very expensive to
produce
> and new ways of perception need to be focused on for better chances for
the
> development of digital art projects. more sponsoring and a better
> communication / cooperation between enterprises and artists might be a
way.
>
> see you, a
> —————————————————————
> kanonmedia.com
> non - profit org for new media
>
> amadeus house
> 99_48, mariahilfer st.
> a-1060 vienna
> call: ++43 - 1 - 920 70 03
> mailto: office@kanonmedia.com
> visit: www.kanonmedia.com
> —————————————————————
> —– Original Message —–
> From: "furtherfield" <info@furtherfield.org>
> To: "kanonmedia.com" <office@kanonmedia.com>; <list@rhizome.org>
> Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 5:55 PM
> Subject: Re: RHIZOME_RAW: Re: RHIZOME_RARE Webby awards…
>
>
> > The only way out of this default like tactic created by such awards that
> in
> > their function perpetrate the problem, is to form our own underground
art
> > awards, for those who are not accepted merely because of not having the
> > money to pay such subscriptions. Yet I can't help thinking that we have
> > enough to do anyway…isn't it up to them, to move on and develop a way
> > forward?
> >
> > marc
> >
> >
> > > how true this is, marc
> > >
> > > —– Original Message —–
> > > From: <info@furtherfield.org>
> > > To: <Rare_Chat@rhizome.org>
> > > Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 5:35 PM
> > > Subject: RHIZOME_RARE Webby awards…
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> > > >
> > > > ——=_NextPart_000_0039_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > > > Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> > > > boundary="—-=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50"
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > > > Content-Type: text/plain;
> > > > charset="Windows-1252"
> > > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> > > >
> > > > BlankBecause furtherfield has a small budget with and all of it it
> goes
> > =
> > > > towards getting various projects underway, we cannot afford to enter
> the
> > =
> > > > Webby Awards. We are continuously getting projects started and into
=
> > > > fruition and have no issue in fund ourselves and projects, sites, =
> > > > experimentations, out of our own wage packets. I was thinking how
many
> =
> > > > other groups who are bothering to create social Internet projects
are
> =
> > > > being left out because of such a situation?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > marc garrett
> > > >
> > > > http://www.furtherfield.org
> > > > http://www.futhernoise.org
> > > > http://www.dido.uk.net/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ——=_NextPart_001_003A_01C1F6AE.67113D50
> > > > Content-Type: text/html;
> > > > charset="Windows-1252"
> > > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> > > >
> > > > <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> > > > <HTML><HEAD><TITLE id=ridTitle>Blank</TITLE>
> > > > <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; =
> > > > charset=windows-1252"><BASE
> > > > href="file://C:Program FilesCommon FilesMicrosoft =
> > > > SharedStationery">
> > > > <STYLE>BODY {
> > > > MARGIN-TOP: 25px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 25px; COLOR:
#000000;
> =
> > > > FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica
> > > > }
> > > > P.msoNormal {
> > > > MARGIN-TOP: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; COLOR: #ffffcc;
=
> > > > FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, "Times New Roman"
> > > > }
> > > > LI.msoNormal {
> > > > MARGIN-TOP: 0px; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; COLOR: #ffffcc;
=
> > > > FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, "Times New Roman"
> > > > }
> > > > </STYLE>
> > > >
> > > > <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2715.400" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
> > > > <BODY id=ridBody bgColor=#ffffff
> > > > background=cid:003801c1f6a6$054a8b60$7828fdd5@FURTHERFIELD>
> > > > <DIV>Because furtherfield has&nbsp;a small&nbsp;budget with and all
of
> =
> > > > it it
> > > > goes towards getting various projects underway, we cannot afford to
=
> > > > enter the
> > > > Webby Awards. We are continuously getting projects started and into
=
> > > > fruition and
> > > > have no issue in fund ourselves and projects, sites, =
> > > > experimentations,&nbsp;out
> > > > of our own wage packets. I was thinking how many other groups who
are
> =
> > > > bothering
> > > > to create social Internet projects are being left out because of
such
> > a
> > > > situation? </DIV>
> > > > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > > > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > > > <DIV>marc garrett</DIV>
> > > > <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> > > > <DIV><A =
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href="http://www.furtherfield.org">http://www.furtherfield.org</A></DIV=
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> href="http://www.futhernoise.org">http://www.futhernoise.org</A></DIV>
> > > > <DIV><U><FONT color=#0000ff><A
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href="http://www.dido.uk.net/">http://www.dido.uk.net/</A></FONT></U><A=
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> > > > href="http://www.dido"></A></DIV>
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> > > >
> > > > + …a shake / to ask if there is some mistake
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> + Hot turks on Cy Young patrol
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